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#1 2007-01-26 20:53:11

Eric Innis
Member
Registered: 2007-01-26
Posts: 2

Hello, I am Eric

Greetings,

My name is Eric.  I live in Atlanta, Georgia.  I am a vigorous student of Japanese martial arts, specifically Aikibujutsu, Aikido, and Shinkendo.  For a while now I have been interested in the Japanese bamboo flute.  I would like to try playing, but I discovered that the price of a flute is too high for something I am yet dedicated to.  It seems the price of flutes rivals the price of swords.  My first thought was to make my own -- I am mechanically inclined and a self made flute would be all the more significant.  However, I suspect that making a flute is something that takes a lifetime of dedication to master, and half a lifetime to become decent at (similar to forging a shinken). I understand there are plastic versions of the shakuhachi which must be cheaper.  But, being a traditionalist, the idea is not appealing.

What is your advice?


Thank you,

Eric Innis
Atlanta Budokan

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#2 2007-01-26 22:06:28

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: Hello, I am Eric

Welcome Eric!

Ah, the ancient dilemma: Bamboo or plastic smile

Non-traditional as it may be, a plastic shakuhachi is a humble but effective way to get your teeth (so to say) into the instrument.

A very useable flute can be made of PVC for pennies and a bit of sweat. Look here: http://www.fides.dti.ne.jp/~sogawa/englishpagepvc.html for a good start (also be sure to look at the maker's collection of bamboo shakuhachi here: http://www.fides.dti.ne.jp/~sogawa/englishpage3-1.html--click on the images for more details).

There is also a shakuhachi cast from plastic from a bamboo flute, and it works very well. It'll set you back 80-100 bucks US.
Take a look here: http://www.shakuhachiyuu.com/ This is a decent way to get started, without a big outlay. It is also
the 'standard' sized shakuhachi, the size mostly commonly used if taking lessons.

Thirdly, if you want a bona fide bamboo flute, but don't want to spend the big bucks, you might try here: http://www.shakuhachi.com/Q-Models-Student.html.
These are not the classic root-end flutes, but are student level flutes made with precision-shaped bores that perform as well as any modern shakuhachi. You can expect to spend about $350.00 for one of
these in the standard size (1.8 shaku).

Finally, the simplest, but not at all the least shakuhachi might be one from Ken Lacosse (originator of this forum known here as Mujitsu):
http://www.mujitsu.com/other.html. Mujitsu makes bamboo meditation flutes which will perform differently from the 'modern'
variety, but have their own inherent strengths and charm. One of these will cost between $220 and $270 depending on the length. Mujitsu
also makes a mean PVC flute (1.8) for $55.00 including shipping.

My own POV on this is that, even if you want to try your hand at making a flute, it makes sense to get at least a PVC flute, to have some-
thing to play and to have a model to work off of. BTW: You don't need to be a master to produce a workable, enjoyable shakuhachi.

eB

Last edited by edosan (2007-01-26 22:09:13)


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

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#3 2007-01-28 00:31:41

nomaD43
Member
From: Portland, OR, USA
Registered: 2006-07-22
Posts: 96

Re: Hello, I am Eric

Hello Eric,
I am also in Atlanta, specifically Alpharetta, and I have been 'playing' shakuhachi for more than 10 years now. I have 6 flutes, including 1 student grade (non rootend) and 2 black bamboo (non rootend) flutes that are 2.1 to 2.3 in length all JiNashi (non laquered bore). I may be willing to part with one of these for about $100. If you would be interested, perhaps we could meet up I could show you the flutes, play a bit (I am not good, only play one piece confidently). If you are interested you can send me an email at nomaDesign@msn.com.
I have been here in Atlanta for nearly 7 years and have been waiting to meet someone who has an interest in shakuhachi, preferably a teacher, but just someone to talk to about the music.

Damon

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#4 2007-01-28 09:24:56

radi0gnome
Member
From: Kingston NY
Registered: 2006-12-29
Posts: 1030
Website

Re: Hello, I am Eric

Eric Innis wrote:

Greetings,

  It seems the price of flutes rivals the price of swords.  ...

What is your advice?

Hi Eric. First, did you check Ebay? Just do a search on "shakuhachi" and you'll find a number of very expensive instruments with a "buy it now" option, and a bunch that are very reasonably priced also with the "buy it now" option.
The inexpensive instruments (many less than $100) probably won't be suitable for formal study, but most likely would be good for learning to blow, and in my experience you won't even know the difference until you get a hold of a better instrument. The reason is that while it's difficult to make a stick of bamboo with holes drilled in it be suitable for whatever the better players are doing, it's really easy to make one play in tune, and while they won't have the same characteristics as the outrageously expensive instruments, they still sound nice. You could also take your chances and go for one of the used flutes on auction. I recently graduated to a better instrument by buying a broken one in an auction for less than $200 and making some admittedly shoddy home repairs, and it's dynamite. It's probably still not good for formal study (the note with all holes open is the seventh of a diatonic scale and I suspect that it's a 1.7 instead of a 1.8, aside from whatever stuff I don't know about), but it suits my purposes very well. The biggest difference aside from the tone quality, which is just "different" not really any better, is that it has a larger range being able to go into the 3rd octave and also a larger range as far as how quietly or loud you can blow along with a bunch of cool wind noises that just don't have the same kick on the cheaper instruments.

I have a pretty good background with transverse flutes, so learning to get decent sounds wasn't much of a chore. If you've never played any kind of flute before you may be inclined to find a teacher, That could possibly limit your options because with many teachers you may be required to get some kind of "standard" instrument. Almost everybody on this forum says that the plastic Shakahachi-Yuu fills this requirement. But, if you just want to blow, and aren't really interested into digging into learning a foreign music (no matter how much you like it, the fact that it's foreign is going to be a major hurdle), just picking up some tips from participants in a workshop would probably be enough. That is if you know how to practice. A lot of what most teachers of any instrument teach isn't just the technical and artistic apects, but how to practice. Basically it boils down to mental focus and exploration into getting a tone and holding it, but sometimes it takes a bit of hand-holding and assurance that your doing OK. Some people without previous exposure to instruments don't seem to realize that 45 minutes to an hour almost every day for a year or two probably won't bring you up to a level that will impress many people except maybe yourself.

Whatever you do, it would be a shame if you let the experience pass you by because of cost when there are so many low cost options available.


"Now birds record new harmonie, And trees do whistle melodies;
Now everything that nature breeds, Doth clad itself in pleasant weeds."
~ Thomas Watson - England's Helicon ca 1580

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#5 2007-01-28 21:18:33

Eric Innis
Member
Registered: 2007-01-26
Posts: 2

Re: Hello, I am Eric

Thank you all for your thoughtful replies.  You have shown me affordable ways to get started and that's exactly what I plan to do.

Thank you,

Eric Innis

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#6 2007-01-28 21:44:44

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: Hello, I am Eric



I would beware the eBay route: You may get something decent for your C-note, but it's a crap-shoot.

Often the sellers don't even know what they've got, as they are not really able to properly evaluate them.



eB


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

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#7 2007-01-29 21:04:54

D.J.
Member
From: Seattle
Registered: 2007-01-29
Posts: 63

Re: Hello, I am Eric

In the past 5 years I have purchased a good number of musical instruments for my daughter and myself, including Shakuhachi. I have found that the danger in buying a musical instrument is not so much controlled by where it is purchased as it is by not doing your homework first.

I have had three particular occasions where I lost a good deal of money: I bought my first Native American flute at a local Seattle music store. It was a very good quality flute but I ended up paying over double what I should have. Buying my daughter’s first guitar at another well established Seattle music store was another mistake, with the sales person happily taking my money for a near worthless instrument. By the time I purchased the third item that I regretted, I had even done what I thought to be good research. One of my first Shakuhachi was from a nationally known maker of supposed good reputation. The flute is a visually beautiful piece. It is in perfect pitch and it is utterly lifeless with a very narrow range of sound.

I learned a great deal in those three first efforts. Know the instruments. Know the maker. Know the seller. Do your homework. And still be prepared for failures. Investing in musical instruments has a particular learning curve attached.

E-bay can be dangerous, but no more than through any other venue if you go in blind.

In the past three years I have found 3 flute makers whose work not only reaches the level of physics needed to make a great flute, but also includes the heart and musical art needed to make the instruments perform with real life. Those makers are Patrick Martin, Rick Heller (both NAF makers) and Perry Yung. I discovered all of them on E-bay. In particular, Patrick and Perry have a certain energy in their work that simply cannot be ignored.

Since then I have knowingly set aside a certain amount of money that is planned for the gamble. I have occasionally taken a stab at a new maker on the scene with no previous reputation. In most cases I have lost. But in the process I learned a lot about the instruments I bought.

In using E-bay I also learned that it is important to start up a long dialogue with the seller first. Pick their brains and get a feel for their integrity and knowledge of their work. This has saved me a great deal of money and disappointment.

Obviously buying musical instruments sight unseen is not as good as having it in your hand first. But with sellers the quality of Patrick, Perry and Rick, who will bend over backwards to help their customers, E-bay is a viable option.


"Manifest great deeds by breaking the rules."
Awa Kenzo - Zen Archery Master
"If you think that you are a teacher, then you have failed to realize that learning comes from the student."
Kiko Aratsu

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#8 2007-01-30 00:44:10

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: Hello, I am Eric



Perry is, of course, decidedly an exception to the eBay warning, as he is one of the moderators of this forum, and beloved by all.



eB


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

Offline

 

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