Mujitsu and Tairaku's Shakuhachi BBQ

World Shakuhachi Discussion / Go to Live Shakuhachi Chat

You are not logged in.


Tube of delight!

#1 2008-01-16 17:58:20

udo.jeromin
Member
Registered: 2007-05-07
Posts: 72

Jinashi vs Taimu

What's the difference between Jinashi and Taimu?

As far as I know, Taimu are wide bore jinashi flutes.
This has consequences for tone, playability, etc
Can somebody explain in more detail (hope I didn't
overlook this, only did a rough search on the forum)?

In particular: what should I conclude when I see "jinashi"
or "Taimu" on www.mujitsu.com/instock.html?

Cheers, udo.

Offline

 

#2 2008-01-16 22:16:35

Mujitsu
Administrator/Flutemaker
From: San Francisco
Registered: 2005-10-05
Posts: 865
Website

Re: Jinashi vs Taimu

udo.jeromin wrote:

What's the difference between Jinashi and Taimu?

Udo,

Good question. "Taimu" is a style or direction of jinashi shakuhachi that Brian Tairaku Ritchie and I have experimented with and developed over the last decade. The term "Taimu" is a merging of portions of our professional names. "Tai" meaning "big." "Mu" meaning "nothing or emptiness." The Big Nothing. We decided to call it Taimu because we feel the style differs from what is conventionally thought of as a wide bore jinashi shakuhachi.

This style is closely related to the wide bore shakuhachi of Gudo Ishibashi and to a lesser degree to the more popular "Hochiku" style of shakuhachi. Generally speaking, the main design differences between Taimu and Hochiku are wider bore, larger, severely undercut finger holes and opened up bottom end.

The goal of the Taimu design is to push the widest bore width to length aspect ratio possible in order to produce the most complex and glowing tone while still maintaining a musically sound instrument throughout the octaves.

Jinashi shakuhachi uses the natural bore of the bamboo as much as possible. Taimu is basically one TYPE of jinashi shakuhachi. It's taking one design to the extreme.

Hope this helps.

Ken

Offline

 

#3 2008-01-16 23:40:01

Yooper
Member
From: Michigan, on the WI border
Registered: 2007-11-26
Posts: 57

Re: Jinashi vs Taimu

On an almost, but not quite, entirely unrelated note:

Hearing the English translation of, "Taimu" always makes me think of "The Tick vs The Big Nothing," one of the goofier episodes of the often brilliantly goofy cartoon about the 400-pound superhero in the skintight blue suit and his flying accountant sidekick.  Season Two, disc two.  And if you're going to check that out, you absolutely must not miss "The Tick Loves Santa!" on the same disc.


"Simple and artless."

Offline

 

#4 2008-01-17 04:56:52

udo.jeromin
Member
Registered: 2007-05-07
Posts: 72

Re: Jinashi vs Taimu

Hi Ken,

thanks for the comprehensive explanation.  Some questions remain

Mujitsu wrote:

Generally speaking, the main design differences between Taimu and Hochiku are wider bore, larger, severely undercut finger holes and opened up bottom end.
...
Jinashi shakuhachi uses the natural bore of the bamboo as much as possible. Taimu is basically one TYPE of jinashi shakuhachi.

So, it's much more than just "wide bore".  Do you mainly keep the natural bore (i.e., get the wide
bore by choice of bamboo) or do you widen it?  Do you keep bamboo node remnants in the bore
or do you "clean them out"?

Mujitsu wrote:

The goal of the Taimu design is to push the widest bore width to length aspect ratio possible in order to produce the most complex and glowing tone while still maintaining a musically sound instrument throughout the octaves.

Sound is extremely difficult to describe (in particular, in a non-native language).
"Complex" - does that refer to overtone richness?
"Glowing" - sounds as if some sound quality "shines through" in a subtle way?
I suppose mp3 (or other digital formats) won't be able to demonstrate the difference well
as much of the overtones are lost in those formats (the ones that engineers say we can't
hear so shouldn't care).

Cheers, udo.


P.S.: Cool, just follow a link to quote --- took me a long time to realize!

Offline

 

#5 2008-01-17 05:38:35

Tairaku 太楽
Administrator/Performer
From: Tasmania
Registered: 2005-10-07
Posts: 3204
Website

Re: Jinashi vs Taimu

Hi Udo,

Here's a video that explains Taimu and compares it to standard shakuhachi.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ij9jN9bq5mI

Ciao, BR


'Progress means simplifying, not complicating' : Bruno Munari

http://www.myspace.com/tairakubrianritchie

Offline

 

#6 2008-01-17 06:27:57

radi0gnome
Member
From: Kingston NY
Registered: 2006-12-29
Posts: 1030
Website

Re: Jinashi vs Taimu

udo.jeromin wrote:

I suppose mp3 (or other digital formats) won't be able to demonstrate the difference well
as much of the overtones are lost in those formats (the ones that engineers say we can't
hear so shouldn't care).

I think the youtube videos give a pretty good idea of the sound differences, but it is a bit more dramatic in person. The reason for this may be because the most unique part of the sound between different instruments is not the waveform, but the attack and decay of the notes. If you listen to soundclips of different instruments playing long tones with the attack and decay of the note cut out of the clip, it's very hard to tell what the instrument is. I suspect the difference between a Taimu and a typical shakuhachi wouldn't be an exception to this phenomena.  My thought is that the wide bore effects the attack and decay of the notes a lot and probably makes for the biggest difference in the sound. The Mp3's capture that.


"Now birds record new harmonie, And trees do whistle melodies;
Now everything that nature breeds, Doth clad itself in pleasant weeds."
~ Thomas Watson - England's Helicon ca 1580

Offline

 

#7 2008-01-17 12:54:53

Mujitsu
Administrator/Flutemaker
From: San Francisco
Registered: 2005-10-05
Posts: 865
Website

Re: Jinashi vs Taimu

udo.jeromin wrote:

So, it's much more than just "wide bore".  Do you mainly keep the natural bore (i.e., get the wide
bore by choice of bamboo) or do you widen it?  Do you keep bamboo node remnants in the bore
or do you "clean them out"?

Udo,

Other than opening up the bottom end, Taimu are generally bound to the dimensions of the natural bore. So, bamboo selection is critical. Sometimes, a few additional blobs of ji are added at points in the bore to improve octave tuning. Sometimes, portions of the nodes are left if they are helpful. If they don't help, they are removed.


udo.jeromin wrote:

"Complex" - does that refer to overtone richness?
"Glowing" - sounds as if some sound quality "shines through" in a subtle way?
I suppose mp3 (or other digital formats) won't be able to demonstrate the difference well
as much of the overtones are lost in those formats (the ones that engineers say we can't
hear so shouldn't care).

By "complex" I mean access to all the various tone possibilities either happening at once or that one can steer towards. Overtones, raspy, breathy, wind, glow, penetrating, depth, smooth, rich. I enjoy the wide palette of tone possibilities that a wide bore design offers.

By "glowing" I mean a bell like reverberation that is heard and felt. The glow is found when, through bore work, a flute suddenly improves dramatically as it reaches its sweet spot potential. In my experience, this "glow" can happen with any style shakuhachi but seems more pronounced with a wide bore design. Although it is something that is more easily heard and felt by the player, here is an mp3 example by Tairaku which I think captures "glow."

Tairaku no cho - 3.0 Taimu (2007 Thylacine Records)

Ken

Offline

 

#8 2008-01-20 05:01:45

udo.jeromin
Member
Registered: 2007-05-07
Posts: 72

Re: Jinashi vs Taimu

Tairaku wrote:

Here's a video that explains Taimu and compares it to standard shakuhachi.

Great!  That's a good resource.  Does "standard" mean ji-ari or ji-nashi in the movie?  Anyway, I do see the point and get an idea of the difference (even if the computer speakers and the digital encoding may only provide a shadow of what is really going on).  Together with Ken's explanation that's probably as much as one can learn via electronic communication methods --- now, in order to learn more, I'd have to try instruments I suppose.

Cheers, thanks for your help, udo.

Offline

 

Board footer

Powered by PunBB
© Copyright 2002–2005 Rickard Andersson

Google