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#1 2010-01-05 17:58:33

waryr
Member
From: Leesburg Florida
Registered: 2005-10-10
Posts: 70

Difficult Go-no-Hi

I finished a nice looking 1.9 last week, but the go-no-hi is very difficult. I can get it with alternate fingering, but it is still hard. Any tips, suggestions, warnings, lambastings, etc.???


If you understand, things are just as they are, if you don't understand, things are just as they are.

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#2 2010-01-05 18:01:01

waryr
Member
From: Leesburg Florida
Registered: 2005-10-10
Posts: 70

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

And by the by, it is a rootend.


If you understand, things are just as they are, if you don't understand, things are just as they are.

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#3 2010-01-05 18:19:31

Mujitsu
Administrator/Flutemaker
From: San Francisco
Registered: 2005-10-05
Posts: 885
Website

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

waryr wrote:

I finished a nice looking 1.9 last week, but the go-no-hi is very difficult. I can get it with alternate fingering, but it is still hard. Any tips, suggestions, warnings, lambastings, etc.???

A difficult go-no-hi is a common issue on flutes with a wider than usual aspect ratio but can occur on thin A.R. shakuhachi as well. Some places to look are the quarter points as well as arbitrary spots above hole #5 to the top end. Adding at the choke point below hole #1. Making sure hole #5 is large enough and undercut. Sometimes adding space at hole #5. Then...test adding at arbitrary spots along the bore. One or a combination of these could help.

It's also possible that none of these help because of the unique bore profile and other features of your flute. Enjoy the maze!

KL

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#4 2010-01-05 18:49:48

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

Ken, you are SUCH a comfort...


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

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#5 2010-01-05 19:33:51

Mujitsu
Administrator/Flutemaker
From: San Francisco
Registered: 2005-10-05
Posts: 885
Website

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

edosan wrote:

Ken, you are SUCH a comfort...

Sadly, my stock market advice is much the same!! yikes

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#6 2010-01-05 20:57:53

waryr
Member
From: Leesburg Florida
Registered: 2005-10-10
Posts: 70

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

Thank you Ken! Such comfort is appreciated. Adding to the maze, this is also a jinashi................I shall take my warm fuzzies and retire for the night.


If you understand, things are just as they are, if you don't understand, things are just as they are.

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#7 2010-01-06 09:09:37

lowonthetotem
Member
From: Cape Coral, FL
Registered: 2008-04-05
Posts: 529
Website

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

You're gonna need all the warm fuzzies you can find this week in FL


"Turn like a wheel inside a wheel."

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#8 2010-01-06 19:22:05

Toby
Shakuhachi Scientist
From: out somewhere circling the sun
Registered: 2008-03-15
Posts: 405

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

waryr wrote:

Thank you Ken! Such comfort is appreciated. Adding to the maze, this is also a jinashi................I shall take my warm fuzzies and retire for the night.

Unless you are a super-purist (and then you have to take what God gives you), it is permissible to add bits of ji here and there in a jinashi to bring all the ducks in a row. John Neptune does this as a matter of course with his flutes.

Toby

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#9 2010-01-06 19:51:11

Mujitsu
Administrator/Flutemaker
From: San Francisco
Registered: 2005-10-05
Posts: 885
Website

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

Toby wrote:

Unless you are a super-purist (and then you have to take what God gives you), it is permissible to add bits of ji here and there in a jinashi to bring all the ducks in a row. John Neptune does this as a matter of course with his flutes.

A benefit of adding bits of ji when necessary is a higher yield of good shakuhachi. It's also possible to add bits of ji while maintaining the general tone color of the flute.

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#10 2010-01-06 22:40:13

Moran from Planet X
Member
From: Here to There
Registered: 2005-10-11
Posts: 1524
Website

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

Mujitsu wrote:

Toby wrote:

Unless you are a super-purist (and then you have to take what God gives you), it is permissible to add bits of ji here and there in a jinashi to bring all the ducks in a row. John Neptune does this as a matter of course with his flutes.

A benefit of adding bits of ji when necessary is a higher yield of good shakuhachi. It's also possible to add bits of ji while maintaining the general tone color of the flute.

Yes! Let's get into the Gi-nashing Ji-mori Wars again!

Really, though, little bits of ji can make a stunning difference in the quality of a flute. Being fundamentalist about not using ji is just, well, gosh-darn it, it's just ... fundamentalist.

Life is short.


"I have come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass...and I am all out of bubblegum." —Rowdy Piper, They Live!

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#11 2010-01-06 22:52:52

Yungflutes
Flutemaker/Performer
From: New York City
Registered: 2005-10-08
Posts: 1061
Website

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

waryr wrote:

I finished a nice looking 1.9 last week, but the go-no-hi is very difficult. I can get it with alternate fingering, but it is still hard. Any tips, suggestions, warnings, lambastings, etc.???

Hi Dave, What a great way to start the New Year!

I would say try everything Ken suggests smile

Does Go no Hi pop into a strange piercing harmonic or is it just difficult?


Best, Perry


"A hot dog is not an animal." - Jet Yung

My Blog/Website on the art of shakuhachi...and parenting.
How to make an Urban Shakuhachi (PVC)

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#12 2010-01-07 01:07:53

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

One thing I have seen John Neptune do:

Get a fix on the problem using the wet paper method or Perry's bead-on-a-string method (John used wet paper in this instance).

If you get some positive results indicating that some addition is required, get an accurate fix on the location in the bore (distance down from the
blown end), and the amount of material.

Put what you think is the requisite amount of 5 minute epoxy on the end of a chopstick that you have marked in order to achieve the established
location in the bore. It doesn't seem to matter much where the blob ends up around the bore, but at the right place down IN it.

And yes, I know: mother nature weeps when we use epoxy, but that's often what John uses to figure things out.

Place the blob, wait 15 minutes. Blow.

Repeat as necessary. I have looked into the bores of some of John's best for-sale flutes, and they were often pretty bumpy and gnarly.


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

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#13 2010-01-08 18:24:35

waryr
Member
From: Leesburg Florida
Registered: 2005-10-10
Posts: 70

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

Perry's "bead-on-string" found it for me!!  Just distal to the fourth hole. I looked into the bore at that location, and found a space where the bit had dug into the inside wall of the bamboo. Now to just insert enuf "bumpy knarly" to fix the sound.

Perry, the go no hi did not pop into harmonic, just wasn't there with regular fingering, and was hard to reach with alternate. (Happy New Year Dude!!!)

I am fully realizing Perry's statement about rising early and playing music on a flute you have made with your OWN hands!

I just love it here in bamboo school!!!!!


If you understand, things are just as they are, if you don't understand, things are just as they are.

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#14 2010-01-11 09:55:38

Yungflutes
Flutemaker/Performer
From: New York City
Registered: 2005-10-08
Posts: 1061
Website

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

waryr wrote:

Perry's "bead-on-string" found it for me!!  Just distal to the fourth hole. I looked into the bore at that location, and found a space where the bit had dug into the inside wall of the bamboo. Now to just insert enuf "bumpy knarly" to fix the sound.

Perry, the go no hi did not pop into harmonic, just wasn't there with regular fingering, and was hard to reach with alternate. (Happy New Year Dude!!!)

Happy New Year Dave!
Glad it worked. A Tuning Bead works better for Jnashi and Wet Paper works better for Jiari...generally.

I am fully realizing Perry's statement about rising early and playing music on a flute you have made with your OWN hands!

I just love it here in bamboo school!!!!!

See you at my making workshop in Brooklyn on Feb 6 wink


"A hot dog is not an animal." - Jet Yung

My Blog/Website on the art of shakuhachi...and parenting.
How to make an Urban Shakuhachi (PVC)

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#15 2010-01-11 17:38:12

waryr
Member
From: Leesburg Florida
Registered: 2005-10-10
Posts: 70

Re: Difficult Go-no-Hi

(Yungflutes: See you at my making workshop in Brooklyn on Feb 6)

Sure wish I could be there in body Perry, but I will have to settle for being there in Spirit this time.

I may be attending the Shakuhachi Camp here locally with Chikuzen around that time. Cool huh?


If you understand, things are just as they are, if you don't understand, things are just as they are.

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