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#26 2010-02-11 12:47:07

Moran from Planet X
Member
From: Here to There
Registered: 2005-10-11
Posts: 1524
Website

Re: hand drums

But seriously, unless you think you need this for new-agey performances, like those didgeridoo players who play one handed while dramatically conducting themselves with the other hand, or, better, you're recording Apocalyptic Shakuhachi Taimu music in Hobart or the backwoods of Wisconsin during a blizzard -- this instrument will be a passing fad and by the looks of it an expensive passing fad. Then maybe you'll be able buy one cheap on eBay if you need replacement Hubcaps for your 1948 Willis jeep.

If you're a mere mortal student of shakuhachi you have plenty of ways to occupy your time (and spend your money). Lessons, 2012 WSF in Kyoto, maybe buy a new instrument if your teacher really think you need one.

Then there's the essentials. Beer. Pay off that six month old electricity bill. New socks.


"I have come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass...and I am all out of bubblegum." —Rowdy Piper, They Live!

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#27 2010-02-11 15:35:52

Karmajampa
Member
From: Aotearoa (NZ)
Registered: 2006-02-12
Posts: 574
Website

Re: hand drums

What do you think of the way this drum is being played relative to the way you play Shakuhachi ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQXn5ba0aT8

K.


Kia Kaha !

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#28 2010-02-11 19:58:31

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: hand drums

Some info on the history, design and fabrication of the Hang:

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hang_%28mu … trument%29


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

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#29 2010-02-11 20:56:18

Moran from Planet X
Member
From: Here to There
Registered: 2005-10-11
Posts: 1524
Website

Re: hand drums

Karmajampa wrote:

What do you think of the way this drum is being played relative to the way you play Shakuhachi ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQXn5ba0aT8

K.

I don't think of it as anything like playing shakuhachi. How do you think so?


"I have come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass...and I am all out of bubblegum." —Rowdy Piper, They Live!

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#30 2010-02-11 21:03:24

axolotl
Member
From: Los Angeles
Registered: 2007-11-16
Posts: 215
Website

Re: hand drums

This instrument isn't going away--it's way too cool for that.  I bought Ravid Goldschmidt's album and enjoyed it thoroughly.  This Manu Delago guy is great too.  smile  Finger slides and bending the sound a la a talking drum--that's cool!

For those who can't afford the instrument, Soniccouture offers a Hang Drum sound library.  Well, that's good for us composers at least.  Otherwise, there's the Hapi Drum, which doesn't have nearly the soft timbre of the Hang and has too much 'slap' for me. 

Here's some Ravid for ya.  "Waving Angels" is his most compelling piece in my opinion, but the version on YouTube has distorted audio. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03_ZzsHH2mA

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#31 2010-02-11 23:42:40

Karmajampa
Member
From: Aotearoa (NZ)
Registered: 2006-02-12
Posts: 574
Website

Re: hand drums

Chris Moran wrote:

Karmajampa wrote:

What do you think of the way this drum is being played relative to the way you play Shakuhach

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQXn5ba0aT8

K.

I don't think of it as anything like playing shakuhachi. How do you think so?

I feel a similar delicacy in the use of tonal dynamics, the way the introduction uses semi-tonal movement like a meri note, the quiet and gentle phrases that pull me in, like some soft Shakuhachi sections, even the almost fade-out later in the piece. There is an attentiveness thathas the focus of blowing. What is perhaps not so similar are the rhythmic periods, but then again, I use similar rhythm too.
I guess it is the overall feel of the piece and the integrity of 
performance. Things I like to have in my own Shakuhachi playing. I don't get this from 'any' piece of music, this piece attracted me this way, hence my original post.
The other examples of Hang Drum did not appeal to me this way.
K.


Kia Kaha !

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#32 2010-02-17 11:41:05

Megus
Member
From: Yoshkar-Ola, Russia
Registered: 2010-02-16
Posts: 15
Website

Re: hand drums

There's a similar instrument - Dreamball. It's produced in Russia. Here's a demo video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3uQSQSnDQGo
And it costs much cheaper than hang drum - ~600$ smile

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#33 2010-02-19 23:57:21

axolotl
Member
From: Los Angeles
Registered: 2007-11-16
Posts: 215
Website

Re: hand drums

I personally don't think the Dream Ball or the HAPI drum has the same tone as the Hang Drum--anything lamellar (with metal tongues) is going to sound a little too mbira/kalimba-like to me.  It has a nice sound...just not the same for me. 

Hang drum doesn't move me the same way that shakuhachi does...because it has a different sound.  Each instrument, sometimes each player, moves me in a different way.

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#34 2010-03-21 00:01:55

Ryuzen
Dokyoku (Daishihan); Zensabo
From: Maderia Park, BC, Canada
Registered: 2005-10-08
Posts: 104
Website

Re: hand drums

This is Sachiko Nagata from Japan who plays, "hamon" steel slit drum created by Teppei Saito.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qgLQw9E … re=related

Would love a set of these.

Cheers,

Alcvin


I live a shakuhachi life.

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#35 2010-04-12 13:47:39

geni
Performer & Teacher
From: Boston MA
Registered: 2005-12-21
Posts: 830
Website

Re: hand drums

just made one out pf propane tank yesterday!! Cool scale D A Bb C Eb G A! I will be using it thursday night!!

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#36 2010-04-12 16:24:36

MikeL
Member
Registered: 2008-05-18
Posts: 55

Re: hand drums

I just looked at the link that Geni provided earlier.
http://www.ehhs.cmich.edu/~dhavlena/for … p-hang.htm

In that document it says:

IMPORTANT: USE ONLY NEW -- NEVER-BEEN-FILLED -- 20 pound propane tanks.
Input keywords such as - propane  tank  explosion - into YouTube to see
the reason why!!

So I went to YouTube and did exactly that. Wow!
The first link was titled " What happens when you shoot a 5 gallon propane tank"

So take that advice if you make one!

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#37 2010-04-12 17:34:50

geni
Performer & Teacher
From: Boston MA
Registered: 2005-12-21
Posts: 830
Website

Re: hand drums

I did check that video!!!
Anyway, the tank was empty. Some notes are 5 cents flat, because the tank was hot when we work on the tuning. But, it sounds so good with Shakuhachi, specially minyo tunes. You can get different key centers with it.
I recorded a video of my playing the drum..but I am a lousy drummer ;-) I won`t posted.

Last edited by geni (2010-04-12 17:35:22)

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#38 2010-04-12 18:18:07

Karmajampa
Member
From: Aotearoa (NZ)
Registered: 2006-02-12
Posts: 574
Website

Re: hand drums

Good one Geni, very cool, I have a big smile on myface.

K.


Kia Kaha !

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#39 2010-04-12 18:50:14

Dun Romin
Member
From: Holland
Registered: 2008-04-19
Posts: 136

Re: hand drums

Pre note: I'm liking this thing a lot more now that a hang drum sold
on E-bay for nearly $10,000 !

Well that's a message! Never imagined something like that when I bought one 5 years ago. That's more then 10 till 12 times of it's original value. smile Better make more work of playing it then. That guy on the video plays awsome.


Tomorrow's wind only blows tomorrow. (Koji)

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#40 2010-04-12 23:31:38

Tairaku 太楽
Administrator/Performer
From: Tasmania
Registered: 2005-10-07
Posts: 3226
Website

Re: hand drums

Dun Romin wrote:

Pre note: I'm liking this thing a lot more now that a hang drum sold
on E-bay for nearly $10,000 !

Well that's a message! Never imagined something like that when I bought one 5 years ago. That's more then 10 till 12 times of it's original value. smile Better make more work of playing it then. That guy on the video plays awsome.

OK now that I know that I'll put this out there-----I'll trade my Hang drum for an Okubo Kodo jinashi or maybe a good Yamaguchi Shiro or Miura Kindo 1.8. So there!

If that doesn't happen, I better start playing it more. It is pretty cool.


'Progress means simplifying, not complicating' : Bruno Munari

http://www.myspace.com/tairakubrianritchie

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#41 2010-04-13 01:07:46

geni
Performer & Teacher
From: Boston MA
Registered: 2005-12-21
Posts: 830
Website

Re: hand drums

YOu guys should use those things...or if you dont maybe lend it to people who may use them ;-)

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#42 2010-04-14 08:16:04

Dun Romin
Member
From: Holland
Registered: 2008-04-19
Posts: 136

Re: hand drums

smile Sorry Geni, I side with Brian for the good trade. But you are right.....we better use the thing. Just to sad that my to-do wishlist always exceeds the number of hours I can get propped in a day.


Tomorrow's wind only blows tomorrow. (Koji)

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#43 2010-04-15 19:25:54

axolotl
Member
From: Los Angeles
Registered: 2007-11-16
Posts: 215
Website

Re: hand drums

Electronic music makers can always use this:  http://www.soniccouture.com/en/products/p27-pan-drum/  I own it and like it. 

Sounds a lot better than a sampled shakuhachi, lemme tell ya!

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#44 2010-04-16 13:06:34

geni
Performer & Teacher
From: Boston MA
Registered: 2005-12-21
Posts: 830
Website

Re: hand drums

This is a link to the video with the propane tank. Yours truly wasting time.…

http://drop.io/qpnpazc/asset/propane-tank-drum-m4v

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#45 2010-04-16 13:52:05

Mujitsu
Administrator/Flutemaker
From: San Francisco
Registered: 2005-10-05
Posts: 885
Website

Re: hand drums

geni wrote:

This is a link to the video with the propane tank. Yours truly wasting time.…

http://drop.io/qpnpazc/asset/propane-tank-drum-m4v

Bravo Geni!

"Livin's mostly wasting time." - Towns Van Zandt

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#46 2010-04-16 13:58:08

radi0gnome
Member
From: Kingston NY
Registered: 2006-12-29
Posts: 1030
Website

Re: hand drums

geni wrote:

This is a link to the video with the propane tank. Yours truly wasting time.…

http://drop.io/qpnpazc/asset/propane-tank-drum-m4v

From that gasp for air at the end I can tell you weren't breathing. I found that trying to not hold my breath was one of the hardest parts of percussion playing (which I never learned very well despite the persistently ringing ears that's evidence I practiced).

BTW, What's the hardest instrument to play? Sometimes I need reminders. smile


"Now birds record new harmonie, And trees do whistle melodies;
Now everything that nature breeds, Doth clad itself in pleasant weeds."
~ Thomas Watson - England's Helicon ca 1580

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#47 2010-04-16 14:36:10

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: hand drums

radi0gnome wrote:

BTW, What's the hardest instrument to play? Sometimes I need reminders. smile

The mind...


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

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#48 2010-04-16 16:55:26

Karmajampa
Member
From: Aotearoa (NZ)
Registered: 2006-02-12
Posts: 574
Website

Re: hand drums

I like that little Gamelon-like phrase at the end.

Are you using some Compression in your recording, there are notes whose volume seems to drop off too quickly in the earlier part.

Another thought, the material that is making contact with the metal will make a difference to resonance, such as those hard rubber mallets.

"the mind is playing but there is no-one playing it"

K.


Kia Kaha !

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#49 2010-04-16 22:06:22

geni
Performer & Teacher
From: Boston MA
Registered: 2005-12-21
Posts: 830
Website

Re: hand drums

Nothing fancy..straight recording in IMovie. The volume drops off  because I was muting the other notes around it, because if you play one-all the others resonate. Also, different notes have different volume. Anyway, it's a good toy.

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#50 2010-04-29 23:54:56

oddmusic
Member
From: OC, California
Registered: 2010-04-29
Posts: 2
Website

Re: hand drums

Colyn Petersen wrote:

... and the hapi drum http://www.hapitones.com/ or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRGqSHZLqlw ...

Howdy,

Just fyi, I sell the Hapi Drum on that site and am the one playing the Akebono tuned drum in the video.

Not here to try to sell anything, I'm actually a "long distance" Shakuhachi student of Ronnie's, living in California, and have been lurking and reading the forum for awhile. 

Actually came here today to finally join the forum, post an introduction, and respond to another post that mentioned me playing the igil (like the shakuhachi, it's another hard-to-play instrument!)  While the Hapi Drum would be considered one of the easiest instrument to play, selling it also affords me some time to work on tougher things like shakuhachi and igil.

I also got a couple of those Hang instruments back in 2001-2002, when the makers asked me if I could help promote it on my oddmusic site.  Who knew how popular they'd become, and then how scarce.  I sold one of them for $500 just before the Hang drought started... not the most savvy business move, but who knew folks would pay ridiculous prices, like 5-8K, just a year later on Ebay.  Oh well, I got what I paid for it, and it's in a good home.... dammit! wink

Anyway, since I saw the Hapi Drum mentioned here, I thought I'd respond, answer a couple questions and get that out of the way, in hopes of actually making a shakuhachi-related post soon smile  It's grown since we started a couple years ago, we have our own molds and source our own recycled steel to control the hardness, etc, etc...  The Hang was a source of inspiration, as was my friend Dennis (also mentioned somewhere above) who was the first to cut up an old full sized propane tank, after seeing an instrument that a fellow from Brazil made, who had cut tongues lengthwise across a big CO2 cylinder.

Yes, the Hapi (a steel tongue-drum) is a LOT different than the Hang, which is tuned with hammers like a steel drum, with harmonics and overtones also tuned into it, which gives it some nice modulation and subtleties.  Playing technique is the same.

We're also as surprised as anyone about how quickly the Hapi's became popular, a lot of non-musicians' first instrument, to some heavy hitters in the percussion world, soundtracks, Broadway, movie effects, kids shows like Dora Explorer and that crazy Sponge Bob show cool and a lot of other stuff I would not have anticipated so quickly or at all.

I also don't see a whole lot of connection between the Shakuhachi and the Hang and similar instruments, though I guess if they are in tune with each other, it can work in non-traditional type settings.  I'm definitely one for mixing things up and doing terribly mean and unspeakable things to instruments, but since I'm pretty new to Shakuhachi (especially in Shakuhachi-Years), so it's the one thing I keep "pure" in my musical exploits.  Plus I have still so much to learn and explore within the traditional repertoire, of which I've just barely scratched surface of.  Or maybe I've only just scratched the first scratch of the scratch on the surface.  Not exactly sure, other than things are starting to get itchy now, which means it's probably time to stop blabbing and hit the send button already.

-- John

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