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#251 2009-05-20 20:27:59

Tairaku 太楽
Administrator/Performer
From: Tasmania
Registered: 2005-10-07
Posts: 3226
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

How come you're not on the list, is this a practical joke?

Maybe we should get together for an actual BBQ but then we'll probably have a major disagreement about who to kill and eat. lol


'Progress means simplifying, not complicating' : Bruno Munari

http://www.myspace.com/tairakubrianritchie

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#252 2009-05-20 20:47:36

chikuzen
Dai Shihan/Dokyoku
From: Cleveland Heights,OH 44118
Registered: 2005-10-24
Posts: 402
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

No joke. I think we need to bring this long conversation to fruition somehow because it's so long, I have to keep going back and re-reading stuff just to remember who said what and why or why not..

Even with all the quotes, it's like a self referential book that keeps quoting itself, i.e. "but I said....". Most of the book is quotes.

I'm not on the list because the little voice in my head didn't mention it.

Do you know that the Japanese word for hemorrhoid is "JI".  JI-ARI?  JI-NASHI?  JI-MORI MORI?  Ha Ha Ha!!

Last edited by chikuzen (2009-05-20 20:58:44)


Michael Chikuzen Gould

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#253 2009-05-20 21:31:25

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

chikuzen wrote:

Do you know that the Japanese word for hemorrhoid is "JI".  JI-ARI?  JI-NASHI?  JI-MORI MORI?  Ha Ha Ha!!

Justice often takes a circuitous path...


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

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#254 2009-05-20 21:42:22

Moran from Planet X
Member
From: Here to There
Registered: 2005-10-11
Posts: 1524
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

chikuzen wrote:

Do you know that the Japanese word for hemorrhoid is "JI".

I really think that is the _last_ word on the subject.


"I have come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass...and I am all out of bubblegum." —Rowdy Piper, They Live!

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#255 2009-05-20 21:56:07

chikuzen
Dai Shihan/Dokyoku
From: Cleveland Heights,OH 44118
Registered: 2005-10-24
Posts: 402
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

Chris, do you mean it should be ARI-JI, and NASHI-JI? WE could call it that to differentiate it from shaku-JI  and JI-shaku. Although, jishaku in Japanese means magnet.

Honestly speaking, I did have a colonoscopy (no joke) this morning and the verdict was:  JI-NASHI!

Last edited by chikuzen (2009-05-20 21:59:43)


Michael Chikuzen Gould

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#256 2009-05-20 22:00:54

Tairaku 太楽
Administrator/Performer
From: Tasmania
Registered: 2005-10-07
Posts: 3226
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

chikuzen wrote:

Chris, do you mean it should be ARI-JI, and NASHI-JI? WE could call it that to differentiate it from shaku-JI  and JI-shaku. Although, jishaku in Japanese means magnet.

Honestly speaking, I did have a colonoscopy (no joke) this morning and the verdict was:  JI-NASHI!

Too much information but thanks for the update. Any plans to post pics? lol


'Progress means simplifying, not complicating' : Bruno Munari

http://www.myspace.com/tairakubrianritchie

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#257 2009-05-20 22:30:40

No-sword
Member
From: Kanagawa
Registered: 2008-07-09
Posts: 115
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

Is it true that pros have posture and lung control so precise you can see light shining through from the other end?


Matt / no-sword.jp

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#258 2009-05-20 22:53:52

chikuzen
Dai Shihan/Dokyoku
From: Cleveland Heights,OH 44118
Registered: 2005-10-24
Posts: 402
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

No-sword wrote:

Is it true that pros have posture and lung control so precise you can see light shining through from the other end?

.

Don't you think that's a bit cheeky?


Michael Chikuzen Gould

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#259 2009-05-20 23:37:02

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

chikuzen wrote:

No-sword wrote:

Is it true that pros have posture and lung control so precise you can see light shining through from the other end?

.

Don't you think that's a bit cheeky?

Might be cheeky, but it's absolutely true. I've seen it many times. Sometimes didn't even have to look very hard smile


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

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#260 2009-05-21 00:11:03

madoherty
Moderator
Registered: 2008-03-15
Posts: 366

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

chikuzen wrote:

Honestly speaking, I did have a colonoscopy (no joke) this morning and the verdict was:  JI-NASHI!

Or was it Hocchiku?  Holy Crap, this has to go on the "Best of Mujitsu and Tairaku's Shakuhachi BBQ" reel.

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#261 2009-05-21 03:58:02

Kiku Day
Shakuhachi player, teacher and ethnomusicologist
From: London, UK & Nørre Snede, DK
Registered: 2005-10-07
Posts: 922
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

lol   lol    lol 

Yeah! I did it!
When I came back from a friend's gig here in London last night, I laughed so much looking at this thread! I had to express that!
Sorry, no personal offence to anyone.

We could also choose a new kanji for ji. Here are a few. They can all be read and pronounced as ji. And there are more:
寺 時 字 辞 侍 痔 持 似 亊 事 仕 児 兒 匙 塒 孳 尓 岻 弍 怩 恃 慈 柿 次 治 爾 珥 璽 畤 磁 示 粫 而 耳 膩 臑 自 蒔 貳 路 臑 自

And to repeat for Riley: I do promise to look at sticky no 1 when I am past the first deadline.


I am a hole in a flute
that the Christ's breath moves through
listen to this music
Hafiz

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#262 2009-05-21 07:10:01

Justin
Shihan/Maker
From: Japan
Registered: 2006-08-12
Posts: 540
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

Riley Lee wrote:

Do you find this discussion enjoyable?

Hi Riley
I know this question was not to me, but I thought to say something.  I find discussing topics about which I am passionate, enjoyable. I love sharing and receiving information. That has been my reason for participating on this forum, and, indeed for participating in this jiari/jinashi thread. I also enjoy a good debate, discussing in a reasoned way using logic and evidence. And the humour of course. I think the forum context is also a wonderful place to have ideas challenged, like putting them into a forge to be hammered and become stronger, more refined, sharper - or even to change their shape entirely. For me it is both entertainment and education (if the two can be separated).

I would also like to say that I don't do well in an aggressive environment. To be honest it makes me physically ill and emotionally disturbed. This no doubt reveals my weak nature, but I have nothing to hide. So my participation in the forum is likely to be infrequent. However if I can help with Michael's proposal for some definitions I would be glad too. I'm sure I know far less than others on the list but I may be able to help out with a few terms, or have queries checked with my teachers.

Justin
http://senryushakuhachi.com/

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#263 2009-05-21 07:57:49

Riley Lee
Moderator
From: Manly NSW Australia
Registered: 2005-10-08
Posts: 78
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

fouw wrote:

I agree with you there, most anybody would. If they're being serious.
But, like several other members  before and after my post, I was kidding.
OK I guess I'll put the filter back on if a lame remark, no offence meant,  gets a dead serious reply.

Best,
K

Well, there's the problem, right there. You go and write a poem in jest suggesting that my brain is overly complicated, when actually it is so damn simple that it can't even see that you were kidding. So of course this simple brain comes up with a dead serious reply. sad

My rule for this Forum is to never take offense regardless of what's been written, otherwise one shouldn't be contributing. As you know, far more offensive posts than yours, had it been serious, have been directed my way.

I apologise for misreading your intentions. That's why I really appreciate all the little smiley things that now even Kiku can use. smile

I suggest you keep the filter off.

Last edited by Riley Lee (2009-05-21 08:08:54)

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#264 2009-05-21 08:03:15

Riley Lee
Moderator
From: Manly NSW Australia
Registered: 2005-10-08
Posts: 78
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

Kiku Day wrote:

And to repeat for Riley: I do promise to look at sticky no 1 when I am past the first deadline.

No worries. No rush. I'm sure this thread can keep puttering along (with regular movements) until you do.

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#265 2009-05-21 14:16:06

Mujitsu
Administrator/Flutemaker
From: San Francisco
Registered: 2005-10-05
Posts: 885
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

chikuzen wrote:

No joke. I think we need to bring this long conversation to fruition somehow because it's so long, I have to keep going back and re-reading stuff just to remember who said what and why or why not..

Michael,

I appreciate the thought and effort of your proposal.

On an internet forum, I'm a believer that smaller government is better government because it gets things done. I have a funny feeling the organization of a Dictionary Committee would make this current thread look like a Swiss Rail Station. Can you imagine debating Horst's input?

Hmmm.. Let's think about what that committee would be like... Pretty scary!

1.Brian Ritchie - Demands "Shakuhachi" be changed to "Tube of Delight."
2.Ken LaCosse - Doesn't get it so remains quiet.
3.Ed Beaty - "Ya know, all terminology can be found by using the handy search function."
4.Dr. Riley Lee - Opens new topic comparing cricket and baseball terminology.
5.Kiku Day - Peaceful yet carries boxing gloves in shakuhachi bag just in case. 
6.Justin Senryu - Submits essay about something.
7. Josh Smith - Too busy with a thesis and a daughter.
7. Daniel Ryudo - Creates controversy with his poem, "Terminology of a Howl."
8. Horst Xenmeister - Constantly declares "Casted boreing is the ending of history."

big_smile  cool

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#266 2009-05-21 15:38:50

chikuzen
Dai Shihan/Dokyoku
From: Cleveland Heights,OH 44118
Registered: 2005-10-24
Posts: 402
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

Thanks Ken. I'm sure my posts had some people scratching their heads, and some their butts wondering how this could be implemented. Of course, I know you guys don't have time to add "Write A Dictionary" to your "to do" lists. You've also saved us reading 7 replies that have already been summed up by Horst.


Michael Chikuzen Gould

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#267 2009-05-21 17:20:23

Tairaku 太楽
Administrator/Performer
From: Tasmania
Registered: 2005-10-07
Posts: 3226
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

Well we've ridden on the "jimori" rollercoaster, puked, and survived. I'd like to thank everybody for their contributions to this discussion. It's amazing how many thoughtful and erudite people there are on the forum. I'd also like to congratulate everybody who took a fair amount of abuse and retained their composure. Special thanks to those who brought levity and humor to the discussion.


'Progress means simplifying, not complicating' : Bruno Munari

http://www.myspace.com/tairakubrianritchie

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#268 2009-05-21 17:21:35

Moran from Planet X
Member
From: Here to There
Registered: 2005-10-11
Posts: 1524
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

chikuzen wrote:

Honestly speaking, I did have a colonoscopy (no joke) this morning and the verdict was:  JI-NASHI!

Sounds more like JI-GNASHI.

Good luck with the results. smile


"I have come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass...and I am all out of bubblegum." —Rowdy Piper, They Live!

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#269 2009-05-21 22:02:04

Riley Lee
Moderator
From: Manly NSW Australia
Registered: 2005-10-08
Posts: 78
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

Tairaku wrote:

Well we've ridden on the "jimori" rollercoaster, puked, and survived. I'd like to thank everybody for their contributions to this discussion. It's amazing how many thoughtful and erudite people there are on the forum. I'd also like to congratulate everybody who took a fair amount of abuse and retained their composure. Special thanks to those who brought levity and humor to the discussion.

HEY! You sound as if it's over!

We have to wait for Kiku to finish whatever she has to finish before her deadline!?!! Don't we?!??? yikes

AND... while I have your attention: have a look at www.princeton.edu 

If the article gives the impression that Tom Hare gave the lectures and I taught the practical lessons, in fact we team taught the lectures. I did all but a few of the practicals, when Tom filled in for me. It was definitely a joint effort and a real pleasure. Twenty bright young Princeton kids are now fluent in two notation systems, can perform three honkyoku representing two different lineages, have heard over twenty honkyoku performed live by three professionals (Ralph Samuelson and Ned Rothenberg guest lectured) and probably have a better overview or grasp of the over all tradition (shallow though it might be) than I did during my first two decades of playing shakuhachi.

Please don't respond to this FYI post here. I'll make a proper announcement and field questions elsewhere, as soon as I figure out in which topic it belongs. This topic in general and especially this thread should keep its strict focus on jinashi/gnocchi, kunrei/hepburn, cricket/baseball, scatology and related matters.

The above link is good only until 27 May (home page changes weekly). After that, see http://www.princeton.edu/pr/pwb/volume9 … /japanese/

For a different, shorter article, from the Princeton alumni magazine, see: http://paw.princeton.edu/issues/2009/05 … /index.xml

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#270 2009-05-22 02:04:43

Kiku Day
Shakuhachi player, teacher and ethnomusicologist
From: London, UK & Nørre Snede, DK
Registered: 2005-10-07
Posts: 922
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

Riley Lee wrote:

We have to wait for Kiku to finish whatever she has to finish before her deadline!?!! Don't we?!??? yikes

Don't get your hopes too high, Riley. I didn't promise to change anything. I promised to look at it. lol


I am a hole in a flute
that the Christ's breath moves through
listen to this music
Hafiz

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#271 2009-05-22 06:54:00

Riley Lee
Moderator
From: Manly NSW Australia
Registered: 2005-10-08
Posts: 78
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

Kiku Day wrote:

Don't get your hopes too high, Riley.

I have absolutely no expectations of you, Kiku, other than common courtesy, perhaps. wink

But it's very possible that if no changes are made to the original sticky, a number of the Forum readers will be extremely interested in knowing why. Again, that may sound like a threat, but it's just an observation. At the very least, it might keep this dead horse of a thread galloping on for another epic test criket match. lol

Last edited by Riley Lee (2009-05-22 23:37:00)

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#272 2009-05-22 12:19:25

Kiku Day
Shakuhachi player, teacher and ethnomusicologist
From: London, UK & Nørre Snede, DK
Registered: 2005-10-07
Posts: 922
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

Riley Lee wrote:

I have absolutely no expectations of you, Kiku, other than common courtesy, perhaps.

But it's very possible that if no changes are made to the original sticky, a number of the Forum readers will be extremely interested in knowing why. Again, that may sound like a threat, but it's just an observation. At the very least, it might keep this dead horse of a thread galloping on for another epic test criket match.

I was, of course, only teasing you - now that we have thanked everybody for humour. Never mind.... roll
Kees, can I borrow your filter - now that you don't need it?


I am a hole in a flute
that the Christ's breath moves through
listen to this music
Hafiz

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#273 2009-05-22 16:28:36

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

Kerry wrote:

Riley Lee wrote:

Kiku Day wrote:

Don't get your hopes too high, Riley.

I have absolutely no expectations of you, Kiku, other than common courtesy, perhaps.

But it's very possible that if no changes are made to the original sticky, a number of the Forum readers will be extremely interested in knowing why. Again, that may sound like a threat, but it's just an observation.

Dr. Lee,
After reading the thread again ( I have the day off wink ), I don't see a number of Forum readers coming forward demanding a sticky revision. From what I gather this is either a more serious linguistic inquiry (if you or Ms. Day already hold Ph.Ds in Japanese language Linguistics, my apologies!) or merely a handcount of opinion, in Japan.
Professor Hare's and your program at Princeton is truly admirable and inspiring.
smile

Last time I checked, this was not a democracy, and Dr. Lee is one of the moderators.


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

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#274 2009-05-22 19:21:55

Tairaku 太楽
Administrator/Performer
From: Tasmania
Registered: 2005-10-07
Posts: 3226
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

edosan wrote:

Last time I checked, this was not a democracy, and Dr. Lee is one of the moderators.

The "not a democracy" thing refers to benevolent dictators me and Ken who host the BBQ. There are not really any moderators anymore except Kiku for "Jinashi". In the past "moderator" and other honorifics were bestowed upon anybody who was a licensed teacher or pro maker or performer. But many of these moderators barely contributed. When we got rid of "Ask the Pro" they were eased into the population. However they still retain one perk which the regular members don't have. But I can't say what it is, it's secret.

Maybe we should start a new category for those teachers who make good contributions to the forum.

In a related note Dan Mayers sent me this pic from his archives. He says the fellow on the left is Watazumi, and the other two dudes are Nishimura Koku and Jin Nyodo. Watazumi can be seen using a hottchiku to apply a few dabs of ji to a horse.

http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc123/Tairaku/beating_a_dead_horse.jpg


'Progress means simplifying, not complicating' : Bruno Munari

http://www.myspace.com/tairakubrianritchie

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#275 2009-05-22 23:35:32

Riley Lee
Moderator
From: Manly NSW Australia
Registered: 2005-10-08
Posts: 78
Website

Re: To Ji or not to Ji that is the question.

Kiku Day wrote:

I was, of course, only teasing you

As the Brits would say, "Snap!"
Translation: As was I, of course.
But, I didn't to put a smile at to the end, to clarify, like you did. I'll put one in retrospectively, though belatedly.

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