Mujitsu and Tairaku's Shakuhachi BBQ

World Shakuhachi Discussion / Go to Live Shakuhachi Chat

You are not logged in.


Tube of delight!

  • Index
  •  » Flutemaking
  •  » Stabilizing bamboo; utaguchi position relative to node

#1 2008-01-08 10:41:00

Windom
Member
From: Finland
Registered: 2007-12-21
Posts: 19

Stabilizing bamboo; utaguchi position relative to node

I was surprised to discover 6' bamboo culms in the gardening section of a department store downtown. Three culms out of fifteen-odd weren't split open, and I bought these for ~$7 each for experimenting. They're sitting in my bathroom now, since it's likely the humidest place in this very dry-aired apartment.

Two of these culms are cut very close to the root with a taper and I hope to get a 6-node and 7-node flute out of them in the 2.7 shaku range if they don't explode (see below). That leaves me with at least four flutes' worth of practice material.

My first attempt, 4-node 2.6 shaku in G sounded very pretty and soft, miles apart from my acrylic flutes. I got as far as drilling the second hole when the flute split open top to bottom with a BANG as I was expanding a 3mm pilot hole with a larger bit. That such a tiny amount of force should blow up the material was somewhat discouraging. Now I have it laurapalmered up in the bathroom so I can see whether humidity could close it up.

Is there anything I could do to try to make sure that at least some of the bamboo doesn't fall apart on me?

My second question, which arose as I was finishing the ill-fated flute's utaguchi, is slightly difficult to formulate in words, so I made a picture showing the cross-section of the top end of a flute.
[img=http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/9383/utaguchiya5.th.jpg]

First I cut the utaguchi as shown in the picture, with the ridge. The result was excellent, but then I decided to shave the ridge off as something in my head told me it wasn't right that way. As I did so, the edge crumbled unpredictably and I could only sand through it to salvage it, resulting in an unpleasantly deep although not hopeless utaguchi. This left me wondering what's the proper way of positioning the utaguchi in relation to the node.

Thanks in advance for any advice!

Last edited by Windom (2008-01-08 10:42:41)

Offline

 

#2 2008-01-08 11:08:47

Mujitsu
Administrator/Flutemaker
From: San Francisco
Registered: 2005-10-05
Posts: 885
Website

Re: Stabilizing bamboo; utaguchi position relative to node

Windom wrote:

Is there anything I could do to try to make sure that at least some of the bamboo doesn't fall apart on me?

I find it's safer to enlarge holes with a dremel sanding disc. You can also wrap coarse sandpaper around a drill bit. As you found out, a drill bit used alone to enlarge holes can grab and split the bamboo easily.

Windom wrote:

This left me wondering what's the proper way of positioning the utaguchi in relation to the node.

Some older jinashi shakuhachi include the ridge behind the utaguchi. I prefer to grind it smooth and flare it open slightly. Sometimes it feels better to include the ridge. If you include the ridge, I think the key is to make sure that it is deeper than the one or two mm. it looks like in your drawing. That way it won't crumble an ruin the edge.

Let me know if this makes sense. Here's a drawing: It's exaggerated but you get the idea.

Ken


http://www.mujitsu.com/images/ridge.jpg

Offline

 

#3 2008-01-08 11:32:37

marek
Member
From: Czech Republic
Registered: 2007-03-02
Posts: 189
Website

Re: Stabilizing bamboo; utaguchi position relative to node

Hi,

I am not a flute maker, but I was just wondering whether you did not forget to bake the boo over charcoal, before making a flute. Probably not.

Cheers,

Marek


In passionate silence, the sound is what I'm after.

Offline

 

#4 2008-01-08 12:24:59

Windom
Member
From: Finland
Registered: 2007-12-21
Posts: 19

Re: Stabilizing bamboo; utaguchi position relative to node

Thanks for the comments! I get what you mean. The ridge is indeed slightly longer - my pic wasn't to scale.

I have been using 60 grit around drill bits to bring holes into rough tune but for bamboo it seems I need to change my evil ways and start from a smaller hole.

No charcoal baking applied, unless someone in the supply chain did it. I don't suppose an electrical stove is any good?

Offline

 

#5 2008-01-08 12:43:20

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: Stabilizing bamboo; utaguchi position relative to node

I think that if your bamboo is not still green that heating it over charcoal (or any other high heat source) will just encourage
cracking. The heating procedure is to remove oils from and reshape green bamboo which has been recently harvested.

If the bamboo you have has been out of the the ground for a while and is cured, I'd suggest leaving it as is.

eB


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

Offline

 

#6 2008-01-08 13:24:13

Windom
Member
From: Finland
Registered: 2007-12-21
Posts: 19

Re: Stabilizing bamboo; utaguchi position relative to node

The bamboo isn't green. It looks old and dried, a sort of yellowish light brown.

That bang that just drove your ears 6 shaku into your skull was a 4-node low E flute splitting after my drill snagged midway through the first hole. This is like trying to defuse a bomb!

How are holes made by burning in a controlled fashion? What sort of a tool does it take?

Offline

 

#7 2008-01-08 13:43:03

Mujitsu
Administrator/Flutemaker
From: San Francisco
Registered: 2005-10-05
Posts: 885
Website

Re: Stabilizing bamboo; utaguchi position relative to node

Windom wrote:

How are holes made by burning in a controlled fashion? What sort of a tool does it take?

A metal rod with a rounded end works to burn holes. Heat with a propane torch until it's red hot. You can experiment with different widths.

A forstner bit will drill a clean hole in bamboo without splitting. 3/8" is a good size to start with. They are available at most hardware stores. Bits from Mejiro are even better!


Ken

Offline

 

#8 2008-01-08 15:17:13

dstone
Member
From: Vancouver, Canada
Registered: 2006-01-11
Posts: 552
Website

Re: Stabilizing bamboo; utaguchi position relative to node

Mujitsu wrote:

A forstner bit will drill a clean hole in bamboo without splitting. 3/8" is a good size to start with. They are available at most hardware stores. Bits from Mejiro are even better!

Forstner bits are awesome.  So are lip-and-spur bits -- that's what I've used with success.

Advice...  Secure your bamboo on a drill press & table to avoid tearing bamboo skin around the hole edges as you drill and especially as you pull the bit out if it has cutting lips around the circumference.  Don't ask me how I know.  smile

-Darren.


When it is rainy, I am in the rain. When it is windy, I am in the wind.  - Mitsuo Aida

Offline

 

#9 2008-01-08 20:11:29

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: Stabilizing bamboo; utaguchi position relative to node

I addition to using Forstner or brad-point bits, it's pretty important to secure the culm in a small vise and
use a drill press for drilling if you don't already do a setup like that.

eB


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

Offline

 

#10 2008-01-14 04:53:51

KODOAN.COM
Member
From: NORTH BEND, OREGON
Registered: 2007-01-16
Posts: 24
Website

Re: Stabilizing bamboo; utaguchi position relative to node

Windom wrote:

How are holes made by burning in a controlled fashion? What sort of a tool does it take?

If you are in an EXTREMELY well ventilated room or are outside, I suggest trying a small grinding stone bit on a dremel (or any other of the high speed rotary tools out there).

the grinding stones can be found in widths of about 4 mm and up. 

One must be careful to not let the grinding stone bit "skip" across the surface of the bamboo but that's about it.  The "skipping" has happened to me only once or twice and was really a result of me just not paying enough attention at the moment.

The grinding stone literally burns through the bamboo (completely through) and can be used as a sanding tool as well. 

I think the biggest benefit is that the burning process doesn't provide an opportunity to "catch" on the bamboo.  Also, I believe that the burning seals the holes quite nicely.

The biggest drawback is the large amount of smoke produced.

Offline

 

#11 2008-01-14 05:02:19

KODOAN.COM
Member
From: NORTH BEND, OREGON
Registered: 2007-01-16
Posts: 24
Website

Re: Stabilizing bamboo; utaguchi position relative to node

Almost forgot!

Occasionally I use a variety of drill bits (including a 1/4" forstner) but I always lubricate them first by taking the side of an old candle to the bit while it's spinning (watch your fingers!) just before drilling.  The wax from the candle is a great lubricant for this sort of thing.  Candle wax also works quite well on hand saws and the like.

Last edited by KODOAN.COM (2008-01-14 05:03:24)

Offline

 
  • Index
  •  » Flutemaking
  •  » Stabilizing bamboo; utaguchi position relative to node

Board footer

Powered by PunBB
© Copyright 2002–2005 Rickard Andersson

Google