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#1 2007-06-29 15:31:08

Lorka
Member
Registered: 2007-02-27
Posts: 303

Question for Brian or Ken

I was looking on the Mujitsu website (often a great source of inspiration) and I found this picture of Brian/Tairaku (sorry I am not sure which you prefer to be called here) and I was blown away by the huge honking monster of a shakuhachi I saw in one of the pictures.  I would love to try a flute like that, it must have such a deep tone.  Also, I must admit, I got a giggle looking at it next to the tiny little girl in the picture, the flute is almost as wide as her head.  here is the link

http://mujitsu.com/images/shakuhachiclubsfo.jpg

I was wondering if you could talk about that kind of flute.  Seems like a super wide bore instrument.  What size of Hocchiku is that puppy?  Also, I would like to ask if a flute that wide can handle the second octave, as I have been told that with the super wide bore instruments the second octave is sacrificed for a fuller first octave.  Just curious.  Thanks in advance.  Very cool flute btw.

Lorka

Last edited by Lorka (2007-06-29 15:33:23)


Gravity is the root of grace

~ Lao Tzu~

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#2 2007-06-29 15:34:02

amokrun
Member
From: Finland
Registered: 2006-08-08
Posts: 413

Re: Question for Brian or Ken

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#3 2007-06-29 16:48:52

Tairaku 太楽
Administrator/Performer
From: Tasmania
Registered: 2005-10-07
Posts: 3226
Website

Re: Question for Brian or Ken

Lorka wrote:

I was looking on the Mujitsu website (often a great source of inspiration) and I found this picture of Brian/Tairaku (sorry I am not sure which you prefer to be called here) and I was blown away by the huge honking monster of a shakuhachi I saw in one of the pictures.  I would love to try a flute like that, it must have such a deep tone.  Also, I must admit, I got a giggle looking at it next to the tiny little girl in the picture, the flute is almost as wide as her head.  here is the link

http://mujitsu.com/images/shakuhachiclubsfo.jpg

I was wondering if you could talk about that kind of flute.  Seems like a super wide bore instrument.  What size of Hocchiku is that puppy?  Also, I would like to ask if a flute that wide can handle the second octave, as I have been told that with the super wide bore instruments the second octave is sacrificed for a fuller first octave.  Just curious.  Thanks in advance.  Very cool flute btw.

Lorka

You can make your own flute if you find a piece of similar bamboo. That bamboo cost about $10.

That flute only plays in tune in the first octave. The trick obviously is to create the tone and close the holes. You need big hands and the ability to focus the airstream. That flute cracked and has since fallen apart. I'm glad I got to perform a legitimate honkyoku on it. I haven't heard of anyone else performing on something quite that wide.

Although I did once play with Ronnie Seldin and gang at the Brooklyn Botanic Garden on a 3.6 (D) Perry Yung made. I did the octave below the rest of the people.

Marco Leinhardt also performs on a 3.6 (D) by Yamaguchi Shugetsu. I played it and had to crank my neck back just to cover the holes. Ouch!

But in terms of diameter I think this one is the biggest. People get all hung up on the length of flutes but width is more interesting to me than length.


'Progress means simplifying, not complicating' : Bruno Munari

http://www.myspace.com/tairakubrianritchie

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#4 2007-06-30 14:11:20

Mujitsu
Administrator/Flutemaker
From: San Francisco
Registered: 2005-10-05
Posts: 885
Website

Re: Question for Brian or Ken

Lorka wrote:

I was wondering if you could talk about that kind of flute.

Tairaku wrote:

width is more interesting to me than length.

Lorka,

Here is a shot of a "one octave" 3.0 (no holes yet) next to a 1.8. Although it's only a 3.0, it plays on D# because of its wide bore. That's lower than a thinner bore flute would be in this length. A 3.6 this wide with standard tuning (even with offset holes) would be extremely difficult to reach.

Ken

http://www.mujitsu.com/images/fatand18.jpg

http://www.mujitsu.com/images/angleone.jpg

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#5 2007-06-30 17:49:57

Lorka
Member
Registered: 2007-02-27
Posts: 303

Re: Question for Brian or Ken

Thanks Brian and Ken.

That is a serious flute you have shown us Ken.  Thanks for the picture.  When you sacrifice the second octave, is the first octave richer somehow, or simply alot deeper than it should be for the length of flute?

I was also wondering what is roughly the widest you can get while still having functional access to the second octave? 

I guess I am asking, is it possible to have your cake and eat it too, with wide bores. 

From the website it seems that the Tiamu functions along those lines, pushing the limits of widebore while still having access to the octaves.  Well, it seems that way based on what I read.  thanks

Last edited by Lorka (2007-06-30 18:06:47)


Gravity is the root of grace

~ Lao Tzu~

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#6 2007-06-30 18:47:34

Mujitsu
Administrator/Flutemaker
From: San Francisco
Registered: 2005-10-05
Posts: 885
Website

Re: Question for Brian or Ken

Lorka wrote:

I guess I am asking, is it possible to have your cake and eat it too, with wide bores. 
From the website it seems that the Tiamu functions along those lines, pushing the limits of widebore while still having access to the octaves.

For me, the Taimu "aspect ratio" (bore to length ratio) is about the widest I can get without sacrificing second register tuning and playability. There seems to be some wiggle room around the fringe that separates one and two octave shakuhachi. I've found the limit can be pushed to increase the "glow" by subtle bore adjustment. The ones that are pushed and adjusted successfully often turn out to be the most powerfully glowing flutes.

There are formulas for aspect ratio that might help one get a ballpark idea of where the limit is. Personally, I have more luck approaching jinashi aspect ratio by feel and trial and error. So, I wouldn't know how to transfer that into numbers. Depending on your approach, the formulas might prove helpful.

Ken

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#7 2007-06-30 20:53:02

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: Question for Brian or Ken

Lorka,

Here's a link which might be of interest on this subject (aspect ratio and performance)--some numbers, if you wish:


        http://www.navaching.com/shaku/bigbore.html

eB


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

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