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#1 2006-01-20 15:39:24

kenwolman
Member
From: Sea Bright, NJ
Registered: 2005-12-25
Posts: 5
Website

That strange buzzing sound....

Now that I've been playing the 2.1 for a few weeks, I'm able to produce a sound reasonably consistently, focus the lips so the airstream is mostly dependable, etc.  HOWever...I have noticed a buzzing or gurgling sound.  This happens mostly when the flute is played without covering the holes.  But it's also happened when some of the holes are covered--so I cannot figure out the pattern.  I've examined the shaku as well as I can, and I don't see any cracks.  It has to be something I'm doing or not doing.  It IS a bit disconcerting to sound like you poured a pint of spit down the bore first but the instrument's still dry....

Ken

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#2 2006-01-20 16:42:11

Mujitsu
Administrator/Flutemaker
From: San Francisco
Registered: 2005-10-05
Posts: 885
Website

Re: That strange buzzing sound....

Ken,

One possibility is that your blowing may be originating more from your jaw and lips. Blowing this way can tense the lips and produce an extremely thin, focused, buzzing tone. It may be helpful to practice exhaling through the flute, rather than pushing the air with your mouth. The lips and jaw can be more relaxed and used more as a funnel for your deep breath to exhale.

I hope this can be of help.

Ken

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#3 2006-01-20 20:12:35

edosan
Edomologist
From: Salt Lake City
Registered: 2005-10-09
Posts: 2185

Re: That strange buzzing sound....

One other thing:

If it's happening all or most of the time you're playing, then it's probably as Ken suggests; too tight an airstream.

If the sound you describe is what I think it is, and happens more intermittently (but not necessarily predictably) then it's a common artifact found in many peoples playing--even very advanced players. I think the Japanese even have a name for it, but I disremember it now. You'll probably find that it occurs more infrequently as time (and practice...) goes on.

The sound I'm thinking of is a very hi-pitched sound that occurs along with the normal resonant of the flute.

eB

Last edited by edosan (2006-01-20 20:13:42)


Zen is not easy.
It takes effort to attain nothingness.
And then what do you have?
Bupkes.

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#4 2006-01-21 00:09:35

kyoreiflutes
Member
From: Seattle, WA
Registered: 2005-10-27
Posts: 364
Website

Re: That strange buzzing sound....

I've seen many of my friends do this with my flutes, and I still do it with an older flute I made. It seems to stem from how close you are to the Utaguchi, or the blowing area. The less space you give between your lower lip and the Utaguchi, the more likely you are to get this sound. You might try "backing away" from it, meaning give the hole between your lower lip and the Utaguchi more space. That seems to work for anyone I'm trying to teach embrochure to. It'll also depend, of course, on your flute, and how the back part of the mouthpiece is shaped compared to the front, etc.

What kind of flute are you using?

-E


"The Universe does not play favorites, and is not fair by its very Nature; Humans, however, are uniquely capable of making the world they live in fair to all."    - D.E. Lloyd

"Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind, and therefore never send to know for whom the bells tolls; it tolls for thee."    -John Donne

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#5 2006-01-22 15:06:27

kenwolman
Member
From: Sea Bright, NJ
Registered: 2005-12-25
Posts: 5
Website

Re: That strange buzzing sound....

kyoreiflutes wrote:

I've seen many of my friends do this with my flutes, and I still do it with an older flute I made. It seems to stem from how close you are to the Utaguchi, or the blowing area. The less space you give between your lower lip and the Utaguchi, the more likely you are to get this sound. You might try "backing away" from it, meaning give the hole between your lower lip and the Utaguchi more space. That seems to work for anyone I'm trying to teach embrochure to. It'll also depend, of course, on your flute, and how the back part of the mouthpiece is shaped compared to the front, etc.

What kind of flute are you using?

-E

As for the flute, it's one of Perry Yung's Earth flutes, a 2.1.  It's really difficult for me to speak intelligently about this because the phenomena come and go, but even when I get booming bass notes out of the fully-covered holes, removing them one at a time leads me to a muffled OR gurgling sound.  There simply is no gurgling when the top two holes are covered, and the only resistance I get thereafter is having to adjust my mouth for that Ro or whatever the equivalent is on a B flute.  I'm finding if I hold the flute at a higher angle from my body, the gurling goes away; but it's not guaranteed.  Sometimes nothing comes out--but with two holes cover, the thing blasts.

Confusion: you mention the lower lip.  I thought the lower lip is far from the Utaguchi in the first place.  The illustrations I've seen suggest opening the space betweent the upper lip and the Utaguchi so I'd be blowing into it as though it were a Boehm or simple-system flute, by letting air pass over the hole.

I wish there were a teacher on my daily line of march because, while I'm confident the problem will be solved, for the time being it's an irritant.

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#6 2006-01-22 16:24:06

kyoreiflutes
Member
From: Seattle, WA
Registered: 2005-10-27
Posts: 364
Website

Re: That strange buzzing sound....

I realize that I might not have made total sense, let's see if I can fix that.

Place the flute correctly on your lips, so that it sets lightly, and the space beneath your lips makes a gentle seal around the back of the flute. If your lower lip is relaxed, just sit there a moment, relaxed, and notice how the lower lip feels against the Utaguchi. You'll feel a little "ovalish" shape or hole where your lower lip gently sets near the Utaguchi. It's not "on it", per se, but near it, creating a hole where you blow. You should get roughly 50% of your air on top, and 50% on the bottom, through the hole you create.

It's when this hole is too small or too big that my friends tend to get the noise you'rea talking about. What I try to tell them (this is much easier in person) is to first try placing your lips in VERY slightly different places (and make sure to be super-patient with this) on the mouth piece. If that's not working for you, find the spot that works BEST, or, at least, most consistently. Once you find a decent "sweet spot", try setting the flute under your lower lip as before, relaxed, and then open your mouth, using pretty much only your upper lip, and think of the area where the flute meets the spot under your lower lip as your pivot point, or HINGE. Very gently, in small movements (again, be super patient with yourself, you'll get it), use this hinge to move the END of the flute up or down. If you've found the best spot for blowing (as described before), then this should help you find the proper angle to blow at. Using this hinge point will also change, again, the size and shape of that blowing hole you tried to create before.

I wish I could sit with you for five minutes...this is one thing I seem to be able to teach my friends well, but it's really hard to write about it.

Have you ever watched another player for any length of time? I've seen a couple, and I also just ordered the Brooks concert DVD: i'm hoping to glean a few things about technique from that, and I hope to start lessons soon. I myself have real problems getting into Kan register, although Otsu is no problem at all. If you're getting Ro, then it sounds like you're on your way...seems like a lot of people have problems playing Ro.

I doubt it's the flute...in fact, I played an exceedingly nice 1.8 recently, and I found it hard to play, probably because I've never tried a flute someone else made, other than the Yuu.

Good luck, and let me know if you have any other questions...I might be able to figure out how to describe all this better later.

-E


"The Universe does not play favorites, and is not fair by its very Nature; Humans, however, are uniquely capable of making the world they live in fair to all."    - D.E. Lloyd

"Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind, and therefore never send to know for whom the bells tolls; it tolls for thee."    -John Donne

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