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Tube of delight!

#1 2009-03-04 20:13:54

radi0gnome
Member
From: Kingston NY
Registered: 2006-12-29
Posts: 1030
Website

Long Tones

I just uploaded a video of me playing long tones on Ro to youtube:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xPj-6M9DDk

  Having taken a lot of silver flute lessons I was always aware that long tones were a really good thing, but it wasn't until after I discovered shakuhachi that I really took them all that seriously because it was just all too easy to revert to practicing wiggling my fingers to get a new piece ready for my next lesson with silver flute. Even with shakuhachi, it's only been just in the past month or so I discovered for myself how cool, and difficult, long tones are.

  What I was attempting to practice here was to start the note softly, increase the volume in a swell, decrease the volume, and to let the note fade into nothingness. It seemed that the practices leading up to wanting to record it were very relaxing and easy enough that it would be a piece of cake. In reality, even though it wasn't much camera fright, it was enough to effect how easy it was to shape the notes correctly. One of the things that inspired me to record it was that I wanted to hear what it sounded like to an outside listener because while practicing I think I can hear my pulse and things going on in my body that I wasn't sure could be heard by anyone listening. Apparently those kind of things can't be heard, but other subtle things like even a small case of nerves can. Of course, I was continually concious that the way to fix that was to relax while I recording, but it's a lot easier said than done. Even though this was another "one-take" video I blew long tones for about 1/2 hour before and was very relaxed going into it knowing that it would help. But I obviously either wasn't relaxed enough, or maybe I'm perceiving myself as being more relaxed and better sounding when not on camera. I'm not all that sure what's going on, but the relaxed state at the end of the recording is acting, where when the camera was off, it would have been for real although probably expressed differently, maybe by sitting down.

  Anyway, if you're like me and have been avoiding long tones for whatever excuse, give it a shot. I think you'll like it.


"Now birds record new harmonie, And trees do whistle melodies;
Now everything that nature breeds, Doth clad itself in pleasant weeds."
~ Thomas Watson - England's Helicon ca 1580

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#2 2009-03-05 11:16:11

Bruce Hunter
Member
From: Apple Valley CA
Registered: 2005-10-10
Posts: 258

Re: Long Tones

radi0gnome,

Thanks for sharing your long tone recording. I found a shakuhachi pitched a minor third lower than yours and proceeded to play along with the recording thus having the opportunity for a long(er) shakuhachi duet. Lotsa fun!

Would you also care to share your thoughts on what effects, (if any), playing both silver flute and shakuhahchi have had on each other? Some teachers have a long-held and cherished belief that the practice is detrimental to both, whereas my take on it is that the more one asks one's mouth to do, the more it will do. Over time, of course, it may take some time for the benefits to become apparent. Anyway, I would be interested in your thoughts.

later...


Develop infallible technique and then lay yourself at the mercy of inspiration. - Anon.

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#3 2009-03-05 11:36:06

Taldaran
Member
From: Everett, Washington-USA
Registered: 2009-01-13
Posts: 232

Re: Long Tones

If I understood the post correctly, is what you mean is that the practice of two different wind instruments would be detrimental to mastery of either?

I play multiple instruments, and I think that idea is wrong. Muscle memory is a magical thing, and as long as you have no neurological/organic deficits, I believe that your ability to learn akin but different tasks is unlimited.

I have no problem picking up a quena after playing my shakuhachi. My guitars and banjos have different size necks, tuning, fretboard radii, one uses plectrums, the other uses fingerpicks. When I pick up either I do not have to struggle to play. As long as you regularly practice. That is the key.

It would really suck if you finished tying bindings on your shakuhachi, and then couldn't tie your shoes afterwards...

But there is always velcro!


Christopher

“Whoever can see through all fear will always be safe.” Tao Te Ching

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#4 2009-03-05 11:46:01

airin
Member
From: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Registered: 2008-10-17
Posts: 303
Website

Re: Long Tones

radi0gnome, thanks for posting the long tone vid and also for posting the one on playing Kan.  I find it so helpful when good players go to the trouble to put up clips like this rather than just sticking to putting out polished CD's.  It is a huge benefit to beginners such as myself to see and hear fundamental techniques demonstrated.  It is a pleasure to be inspired by top level playing but the reality is those of us starting out are no where near that level and can gain a lot from examples entry level skills.  Again, thanks!

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#5 2009-03-05 14:01:37

radi0gnome
Member
From: Kingston NY
Registered: 2006-12-29
Posts: 1030
Website

Re: Long Tones

Bruce Hunter wrote:

radi0gnome,

Thanks for sharing your long tone recording. I found a shakuhachi pitched a minor third lower than yours and proceeded to play along with the recording thus having the opportunity for a long(er) shakuhachi duet. Lotsa fun!

I glad you tried that. At one point I thought of using a 1.8 for that reason, but I thought the flute I used was more meditative and was the one I was using when I first thought "hey, I should record this", so I stuck to that one.

Also, it had crossed my mind as a musical game/experiment/internet-project to start with an MP3 of long tones, pass it along to someone else to build another layer onto it and continue until it reaches a saturation point. I'm not sure how the logistics would work, but since the internet shakuhachi community that would have the expertise to layer onto an MP3 (it's not that hard but there's a learning curve) is small it probably wouldn't end up with everybody in the world wanting to participate like a similar project would with guitar so that part of the logistics would probably take care of itself. But that's for later, unless someone else wants to start it.     


Bruce Hunter wrote:

Would you also care to share your thoughts on what effects, (if any), playing both silver flute and shakuhachi have had on each other? Some teachers have a long-held and cherished belief that the practice is detrimental to both, whereas my take on it is that the more one asks one's mouth to do, the more it will do. Over time, of course, it may take some time for the benefits to become apparent. Anyway, I would be interested in your thoughts.

I'm kind of surprised, what teachers have said that? They probably have reasons that make sense, otherwise they wouldn't be saying that, but in my experience playing different flutes doesn't hurt. I even have a suspicion that playing other flutes helps each instrument. I've heard it said a lot that silver-flute players shouldn't play sax. I'd be inclined to agree with that because I find it hard to play sax and then immediately pick up a flute, but there are a bunch of flute/sax doublers who are very good at both instruments so I'm hesitant to state it as a fact that even flute/sax is bad. If your looking for good shakuhachi/silver-flute doublers, James Schlefer plays both, so if they do hurt each other either it's not by much or the problems aren't insurmountable (I kind of think that's the case with flute/sax BTW).


"Now birds record new harmonie, And trees do whistle melodies;
Now everything that nature breeds, Doth clad itself in pleasant weeds."
~ Thomas Watson - England's Helicon ca 1580

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#6 2009-03-05 14:19:20

radi0gnome
Member
From: Kingston NY
Registered: 2006-12-29
Posts: 1030
Website

Re: Long Tones

airin wrote:

radi0gnome, thanks for posting the long tone vid and also for posting the one on playing Kan.  I find it so helpful when good players go to the trouble to put up clips like this rather than just sticking to putting out polished CD's.  It is a huge benefit to beginners such as myself to see and hear fundamental techniques demonstrated.  It is a pleasure to be inspired by top level playing but the reality is those of us starting out are no where near that level and can gain a lot from examples entry level skills.  Again, thanks!

Airin, You're welcome. The idea behind the videos was that when I was learning Irish music teachers were few and far between but all you'd have to do is go to a music session at a local Irish pub and you'd find players at all levels willing to show you something even if it was a stretch to call it "teaching". In the shakuhachi community players are more sparse and the music doesn't loan itself as well to get-togethers so that opportunity doesn't exist. However with internet technology something similar can be accomplished, so why not? It was really minimal time and effort and makes me feel a lot more integrated into the internet shakuhachi community, so it's a win-win. I'm glad you liked it, I certainly did.


"Now birds record new harmonie, And trees do whistle melodies;
Now everything that nature breeds, Doth clad itself in pleasant weeds."
~ Thomas Watson - England's Helicon ca 1580

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#7 2009-03-06 04:38:10

Bruce Hunter
Member
From: Apple Valley CA
Registered: 2005-10-10
Posts: 258

Re: Long Tones

Taldaran wrote:

If I understood the post correctly, is what you mean is that the practice of two different wind instruments would be detrimental to mastery of either?

I play multiple instruments, and I think that idea is wrong. Muscle memory is a magical thing, and as long as you have no neurological/organic deficits, I believe that your ability to learn akin but different tasks is unlimited.

I concur. I once sat in a pit or a musical with seventeen instruments. It's all in what is trained to do. On a daily basis, in my teaching studio, I will change instruments every half-hour, and by the time the week is over, will have covered most of the band and orchestra instruments. (Over the years, I *have* covered them all, and a few others for good measure.) 8^)

And that, is why I was overjoyed to discover shakuhachi. Pitches and colors I was wanting were not available on the instruments I was playing, and when I attempted to find them, I was discouraged, and people around me were not very happy either. 8^)

later...


Develop infallible technique and then lay yourself at the mercy of inspiration. - Anon.

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#8 2009-06-04 19:19:31

M51
Member
Registered: 2009-06-03
Posts: 1

Re: Long Tones

Thank you for posting the vid. I play silver flute as my primary instrument and often forget to apply various exercises to my other instruments. Thank you for the reminder. smile

I play several instruments as well. As Bruce illustrated, I have had teachers tell me not to pick up another woodwind outside of flute if I am going to play seriously. Their take was that it would ruin my embouchure. I respect their opinion, but disagree. My solution: I stopped telling them. smile The only issue I have encountered is a little fatigue if I play a flute and a reed instrument back to back. As long as the correct embouchures are in place for each instrument, I don't see a problem. There's too many beautiful instruments out there to explore. smile

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